[00:00:00] – Frankie
You’re listening to the Doing It For The Kids podcast, where we swear a bit too much and talk a bit too fast about freelance life with kids in the mix. I’m Frankie, and this is Steve.

[00:00:08] – Steve
Hello, yes, each episode, we take a question from the Doing It For The Kids community, except this one is a little bit different because what we have done is garner the thoughts of the Doing It For The Kids community about how to survive-,

[00:00:22] – Frankie
The summer holidays. We’re doing it backwards this time. We have, yeah, gathered loads of comments in advance. We’re going to read them out and then give our take and our experiences around it.

[00:00:31] – Steve
Nice.

[00:03:20] – Frankie
So in this episode, we’re talking all about the summer school holidays. This is because I put a call out on Instagram, and was like, “Hello, we need questions for the podcast.” And the number of messages I got that were about the summer holidays, it was quite clear to me this was the subject people wanted us to talk about. And then, Penny Brazier messaged me and said, I’m going to quote her, “I’m eternally curious about how people tackle the summer holidays once they’ve got school-age kids. It’s an impossible equation, and there’s no one answer, but I feel like we can maybe come closer to our own personal truth by hearing how other people do it to try and glean some inspiration. So what about an episode where you gather responses first and then you go over them, including yours and Steve’s own methods? I’m sure the Doing It For The Kids crew have hacks that we don’t know about.” So basically, Penny is responsible for this. Thank you, Penny.

[00:04:12] – Steve
Thank you, Penny.

[00:04:14] – Frankie
Because I thought, yes, that’s a genius idea.

[00:04:17] – Steve
So we got a message from Imogen Partridge who says,

“It’s my first school holidays.”

Well, I mean, that’s how I’m reading it. It could be, “It’s my first school holidays.”

Imogen continues,

“The plan is-,” well, I mean, okay, here’s the first good point here, right? She’s got a plan.

[00:04:33] – Frankie
Yeah, right. But also winging it. I mean, that’s how I would summarise my experience, a combination of the two.

[00:04:39] – Steve
Imogen continues,

“The plan is one day a week, my parents will have them.”

Oh, my gosh, right. I mean, yeah, the plan just got better.

“A couple of weeks away. And then just hope he gets engrossed in Lego and drawings, TV here and there. Plus,” and I like this phrase, “content trips, aka drawing out and about somewhere and recording it for socials.”

Worth pointing out Imogen is an illustrator and artist.

Imogen says,

“That definitely sounds like I’m using him a little bit. But we had a lovely trip to a local lake the other week. He rode his bike around, we sat, did some drawing for an hour or so with some exploring through the bushes, too. And then we went to the bike park bit, and then we came home and made a bit of content about it. We both enjoyed it.”

[00:05:22] – Frankie
I freaking love this. Like, she said it sounds like I’m using him a bit. I don’t think it does. I think it sounds like a great day out. And then you had loads of cute video content that you could put on socials. Like, yeah, and I love that she has a job where she can do that. So being able to go out with a piece of paper and a pen and hang out with your kid, but then be able to use that for work, that is sweet spot stuff, isn’t it?

[00:05:47] – Steve
So Imogen, we like your plan.

[00:05:48] – Frankie
Yes, we do. High five.

[00:05:50] – Steve
We like the phrase content trips.

[00:05:53] – Frankie
Yeah.

[00:05:53] – Steve
And you know what? Depending on the age of the kid as well, if you involved them in the editing of it and things like that, then, you know?

[00:06:00] – Frankie
Everything is content. We’ve got another first-time summer.

Zoe Pickburn says,

“This will be our first proper summer, and she’s currently only in childcare three days a week. The plan. Adjust my business model so I can front load most of my work during term time. Very much a work in progress at the moment. Be very honest and open with other clients that I have vastly reduced availability in the school holidays. I am very lucky that my mum will still take her one day a week, so I do have some dedicated time at my desk. Then the usual. Work after bedtime, rely on TV, a few co-working playdates with friends, ruthlessly prioritise, have a mental breakdown, bon appétit.”

You won’t be alone, though. I imagine lots of people will be relying on after-bedtimes and/or early mornings. Somebody did comment saying, I’m getting up at 4:30, and I was like, are you? Okay.

[00:06:58] – Steve
If that works for them and their body clock.

[00:07:00] – Frankie
Absolutely. That would destroy me, but you know, each to their own.

[00:07:05] – Steve
Richard Berks says,

“I always massively overestimate what I can get done in the summer holidays, work-wise, but also everything else-wise. One thing that has helped me is just to accept that during the summer, I will only get the bare minimum work done.”

[00:07:22] – Frankie
Yes.

[00:07:23] – Steve
Richard continues,

“What’s the solution? Unhelpfully, I don’t know. But I’m getting less uncomfortable with this fact and less resistant to the idea that there will never be a perfect summer where I get everything done that I want to. And even this ignores that I have to make sure my kids don’t go insane or get upset at being left at another holiday club again and also trying to go on holiday and enjoy it and meeting up with friends and making the most of the wonderful weather, but also trying to relax, etc, etc. Basically, my approach is this. Drop the expectation that the perfect work-life balance is possible during the holiday. Underestimate how much I can get done, and maybe, just maybe, I’ll feel a little less frustrated and a bit better about things. Good luck, everyone.”

[00:08:10] – Frankie
Sage advice from Richard.

[00:08:12] – Steve
It’s so relatable. Feeling frustrated. You see, and that’s the thing, isn’t it? Frustration a lot of the time comes when we don’t have the wiggle room for when plans change, when we have overestimated how much we can pack in.

[00:08:28] – Frankie
Yes, big time. Relate to that.

[00:08:29] – Steve
As well. So much of what he says, all said the summer holiday camps. So there was a point when our son was at school, but our daughter was still in nursery. And so I would pay for him to go to an all day camp. Actually, that was a lot longer than normal school. So it was like half eight till half four or five. She was in nursery, so I could get a lot done. But you have to weigh up because those things are expensive. So you have to weigh up. Have I actually got the stuff to do on this day? And how many of those days do I need?

[00:09:01] – Frankie
Yes, exactly that.

Lauren Webb said,

“I always liken the summer holidays freelance life, booking clubs issue to the chicken and egg question. What do I do first? Book in a few clubs on the chance I’ll have work and keep my sanity or hold off until the last minute and hope everything isn’t booked up. At the moment, I’ve done the former.”

But that’s exactly it. It’s like-, I mean, that’s freelance life all over with kids, isn’t it? Can I commit to two nursery days a week if I don’t have any work? You know, it’s exactly the same situation over the summer. Should I pay for those camps and hope the work comes in or should I book the work and-,

[00:09:37] – Steve
And then our daughter, by the time she was able to go, first of all, she was keen to go because she’d always seen her big brother go. Then she actually experienced what it was like and was like, “I don’t want to go here.” And then it made it so much tougher because he seemed to go off and make friends, have a good day. She really didn’t want to go. So I didn’t feel guilty about him, but I really felt guilty about her because she made me feel guilty about it. Then you realise, I’m paying so much money for two children to go here and you’re making me feel bad about it.

[00:10:06] – Frankie
You feel shit about it, yeah.

[00:10:08] – Steve
So in the end, we abandoned the school camps idea.

[00:10:11] – Frankie
It is something to bear in mind if you are at the start of this and you’re like, oh, clubs are the solution because I would love to tell you they are, but it’s not a given. It really isn’t. It massively depends on your kid and whether you have other children, the dynamics of that, whether their friends are going, what the activity is, how far away it is. So like, that whole what Richard is saying about not over committing and thinking you’re going to get loads done when in reality, yes, you book the clubs, but even the clubs might not work out exactly as you anticipate them to.

[00:10:42] – Steve
Hayley Watts says,

“I’ve tried a lot of things over the years. There are two things that definitely don’t work for me. One, being on work mode and parenting mode at the same time.”

[00:10:54] – Frankie
Yes, rules for life.

[00:10:55] – Steve
Hayley continues,

“Like most people, I can’t actually multitask, so I give myself permission to let my son entertain himself often in the morning, so I do a couple of hours, and then I switch off and I’m in mum mode. Number two, remembering I’m not Superwoman. Managing my expectations of myself is the thing I find the hardest. I don’t want to stop working for six weeks. I love what I do. But I have learned that over the summer, I’m probably mainly in reactive mode. Any proactive work is scheduled in for when I have kids clubs/playdates. He’s too old for both now, but it helped before. I take a few days off to recharge before and after the holidays too, and have at least a week fully off during the summer as well.”

[00:11:38] – Frankie
Yes, public service announcement. You deserve a holiday, even if it’s at home, whatever. Some actual time off where you’re not looking at your emails. I know as self-employed people, that is easier said than done, and we are all very guilty of letting boundaries slip. But if you can book that time, do it.

[00:11:58] – Steve
I also like Hayley’s thing there about taking time off to be charged before and after the holidays.

[00:12:03] – Frankie
Yes. Nina Lenton also backs up the idea.

She says,

“You will not feel motivated in the first two weeks of September, so plan for that to happen.”

That was a surprise to me when we went from reception to year one. Maybe take a few days to ease yourself in gently. Wise.

[00:12:23] – Steve
Lucy Aspinal said,

“Our kiddo finds it particularly challenging to access childcare, so me and my best friend, who also works from home, are getting together for working playdates.”

[00:12:34] – Frankie
Yes.

[00:12:35] – Steve
“Hopefully, the kids are old enough to entertain each other whilst being semi-supervised so they can enjoy time together and we can work.”

Oh, my God. When you get two kids who just get on.

[00:12:45] – Frankie
Yes, it’s like gold dust.

[00:12:48] – Steve
Lucy says,

“We’re also buddying up with some friends who send their kid to a play scheme in the hope that this will be enough of a pull to encourage our kiddo to join once a week.”

Nice idea, fingers crossed.

“Other than that, lots of transparency with clients,” says Lucy.

The transparency with clients, I think that also helps take that pressure off. One way to be transparent with that is in your out-of-office, I know we mention them a lot. Or your email signature. You know, just setting the expectation on when an email will be replied takes the pressure off. I remember once replying on a holiday to some emails at the top of a jungle gym frame at Dinosaur Adventure Land in Norfolk.

[00:13:27] – Frankie
Yep, sounds familiar.

[00:13:28] – Steve
The top of the adventure frame was the only place you could get decent phone signal. So there were quite a lot of parents at the top of it.

[00:13:38] – Frankie
Sarah Wolf also says-, this is great. I love it.

Sarah says,

“This year, for the first time, I made a very simple spreadsheet with dates over the summer when we needed childcare and any ideas for clubs. I sent it round to the parents of my daughter’s friends, and they filled it in for their own kids. So we can all see when they pair up for clubs and if we can offer any reciprocal childcare. It so far, it seems to have been pretty helpful for everyone, even though most people aren’t freelancers.”

[00:14:03] – Steve
Brilliant. I love that.

[00:14:06] – Frankie
It’s next level. I mean, the organisation.

[00:14:10] – Steve
So speaking of being organised, Penny Brazier says,

“Having spent a few years trying to wing it and work around the kids as and when, I’ve learned this is fast-,” this is in caps lock, “this is a fast track to burn out. I now block every single day out and call in favours early. So by about mid-June, I know exactly when my partner is going to be on childcare duty, when we can rope someone else in, when the kids have clubs booked, when we’re away on holiday, when I’m working but the kids are home, aka juggle days, which I keep to a minimum to avoid lockdown flashbacks, and when I’ve got days off work to spend with the kids. This goes on a chart on the fridge to refer to whenever anyone asks me what the hell is going on that day. Doing it early means I can let clients know and I try to be as boundaried as humanly possible so I can actually spend some time with the kids without constantly checking my emails. It feels like a military operation, and it kind of is, but it’s the best way I’ve found to get to September and not feel like I’ve been hit by a bus.”

[00:15:14] – Frankie
I so relate to that whenever anyone asked me what’s going on that day. My daughter, every day is like, “What are we doing today, mummy? What are we doing today?” Even, like, the night before, “What are we doing tomorrow, mummy? What are we doing?” She’s like a puppy. It’s like, “Where are we going? What are we doing?” Being able to just go, “Look at the chart. That will tell you.”

[00:15:31] – Steve
I was going to say maybe she could fill in the chart.

[00:15:33] – Frankie
Yeah, right. Do some little drawings.

[00:15:35] – Steve
Well, what’s happening today? Well, you drew it. You drew it last night before bed. Go take a look.

[00:15:39] – Frankie
So we’ve got a million calendars. Me and Rob have got a shared Google calendar where all the school stuff goes in. And then I’ve got a wall calendar for work, which is in the office. Then the kids have got a wall calendar, which is specifically for kids. So like, it’s got silly things on it, things like National Fart Day, and that kind of stuff. They love it. But my plan is to write all the summer plans on their calendar by their bedrooms. So they know, you know, on Tuesday, we’re going to this club or seeing this friend or whatever it is. And then me and Rob have also got-, it’s ridiculous.

[00:16:15] – Steve
Oh my God.

[00:16:15] – Frankie
We’ve also got an old-school just paper calendar in the kitchen downstairs. So my plan is to do our version there so we know what’s happening when we’re making breakfast or whatever. We can look at that one and then have the kids run upstairs by their bedroom. So when they go to bed, they’re like, “Oh, tomorrow we’re doing this.”

[00:16:33] – Steve
Wow. You’re going to have to block out several days to fill in all the calendars.

[00:16:38] – Frankie
It sounds nuts, but this is how my brain works.

[00:16:42] – Steve
Do you know what, though? I think that’s important is that you can listen to everybody’s way of doing it, but you shouldn’t feel bad about your way of doing it if it works for you.

[00:16:52] – Frankie
Yes, absolutely.

[00:16:53] – Steve
And also you should try different things out to find out what works for you. Also in Penny’s message, is the line, “When my partner is going to be on childcare duty.” Which I think it’s quite a good one because I always used to feel-, if you don’t know our story as it were, you know, my wife would always be in London working in London. You know, the got the proper job.

[00:17:14] – Frankie
In inverted commas.

[00:17:15] – Steve
I felt, and I kind of think she felt, that childcare in the holidays just fell to me.

[00:17:21] – Frankie
Yes. Who can relate to that? Anyone? Anyone?

[00:17:24] – Steve
Right. So it is a conversation worth having to remind them that actually they get paid to take time off. They can take time off, look after kids. And if they’ve taken time off to hang with the kids, then maybe you can go and work in a co-work space or a library or they get to go out for the day or however-, but don’t get them roped into still being.

[00:17:48] – Frankie
Yeah, they’re not looking after the kids downstairs, ie, they’re knocking on the door while you’re trying to work upstairs. There needs to be, yeah, separation. Yes, this leads nicely onto Sam Kennedy Christian’s comment.

Sam says,

“My overarching tip is make it visible. My husband and I are literally about to stand next to the planner on our kitchen wall to talk about it. We’re both currently freelance, so with lots of theoretical flex, but we do both also want to be booking work in. I have a Trello board with lots of lists of ideas at home, things to do local to us and trips we can pick from. It’ll be me and my seven-year-old for much of the holidays, I think, but I’m checking in now to agree when it’s officially not my day.”

Although I can see the default parenting sneaking in there, ie, it’s probably going to fall to her most of the time is what she’s saying, but she’s trying to avoid that by having the conversation early.

[00:18:39] – Steve
I like this list of ideas, things to do, a list to pull from.

[00:18:43] – Frankie
I haven’t written it down, but Liz Bell said,

“This is a really good chance to use AI. This is what AI is for.” She was basically like, “I asked ChatGPT to find all the stuff near me for my kid’s age range over summer ’25 and categorise it and tell me when it’s on and all that stuff.” And she said, “Yeah, it threw up some good stuff she didn’t know about”, and was a good example of using tech to your advantage rather than trawling through search.

[00:19:14] – Steve
Oh, man, it used to wind me up. The fact that one of our kids would want to do something and the other wouldn’t. Take them to the park and play football, but the other one doesn’t want to go. The other one wants to ride their bike and the other one doesn’t. You know, so there’s constant negotiation.

[00:19:31] – Frankie
Yes. I feel like I’m approaching that peak. My son’s just turned 10, but I feel like when he’s 11 and she’s seven, there’s going to be some real juxtaposition with the things that they want to be doing.

[00:19:45] – Steve
Actually, Elizabeth Mithso had a comment on this topic.

Elizabeth says,

“I’m already panicking. I’ve got an 11-year-old about to transition into secondary, so she’s not up for any silly clubs, which then leaves my eight-year-old saying, “Why should I have to go by myself then?” Fair play. Which then leaves me with two girls while trying to work every day, usually bickering about whose slime it is.”

[00:20:09] – Frankie
Katherine Kendall-Boucher says,

“This is my first summer in 12 years where I actually have a lot of work. I usually drop my workload to the bare minimum over any school holiday, but now they’re older, I feel I can take more work on. Before, it was just a case of nursery or holiday clubs, but this year, my general plan is to work a couple of hours in the morning when they can amuse themselves, then stop for lunch, spend the afternoon with them, and then do a couple more hours whilst my husband takes over the childcare dinner cooking duties. I’m a natural night owl, so working in the evening is definitely part of the plan. I’m sure holiday clubs will feature somewhere along the way, too, as we don’t have any family nearby to help. But as my eldest is just about to hit 12, he’s already being quite teenage about it and turning his nose up at most things. But he’s allowed to go off to the park with his mates now, so I expect this to be my first summer, where I hardly see him.”

[00:21:00] – Steve
It kind of aligns with my plan, as in I find that now that our kids are older, in the morning in particular, they’re happy doing their own thing. They don’t get too bored until after lunch. So that’s when I’m planning to mostly work, because actually, if you think about it, if you can work from, say, 8am until 12, 1 o’clock, that’s a good chunk of time. But I do find it helps to have some plan each day. But also, caveat, I have been guilty in the past of booking too many things to do. It was like, tickets to see this show, and then you’re dragging two kids along to see a magic show they have zero interest in whatsoever. And actually, they’re quite happy, perhaps playing, I don’t know, badminton in the garden. Basically, it doesn’t always have to be so full on.

[00:21:53] – Frankie
It’s a really good point, actually, because I think there’s a lot on the social medias. Look at all the amazing things you should be doing this summer. Go to this place and that place. Maybe you might feel pressure to be doing a lot of those things. But oh, my God, A, they cost an absolute bomb. And when you’re a freelancer, remember, you were already taking the day out. That is costing you money. You’re not working. To then, like, pay to do stuff. Like, that is expensive. And B, yeah, it’s exhausting. It really is. I’m guilty of going the other way and have no plans, and then everyone goes nuts. So I wouldn’t recommend that either. I think there is a sweet spot in the middle.

[00:22:31] – Steve
Emily Doris said,

“When my daughter was little, I used to make supermarket trips more fun by giving her a list of things we needed to get and getting her to help me. Most kids love to help. It keeps them busy, feeling part of a team. It turns chores into bonding time. Now she’s a tween, things haven’t changed all that much. First week of the summer holidays, I’ll be working from home as usual. So as well as her watching too much Netflix, singing and dancing in her room, going to summer football camps and having friends over on mornings, afternoons when I’m working, she’s also going to join me for a bit of work as my PA.”

[00:23:04] – Frankie
Yes.

[00:23:05] – Steve
Emily continues,

“What’s she working on? Well, one task is using ChatGPT to create a meal plan for the week and then to use that plan to create the online food shopping order. It’s a big job but involves learning new skills, getting excited about what meals we’re having this week. I’ll expect she’ll want to make a couple. And we’re working alongside each other. And later, because we’ve worked hard today, we’ll have a girls’ night with candles, face masks, and a good film.”

[00:23:28] – Steve
Yes.

[00:23:30] – Frankie
Love it.

[00:23:32] – Steve
That also reminds me of when-, because obviously, I make podcasts, and I remember when our daughter wanted to make a podcast as well. And so it was great. I carried on working, and she went off and recorded a podcast, basically just chatting away. Imagine just chatting away.

[00:23:49] – Frankie
Yes, my six-year-old was doing that the other day, she found my little, like, what do you call it? Those little portable ones with the funny microphones on top. She was just wandering around the house going, “Here I am in my room.”

[00:24:00] – Steve
But then, right, show them how to edit this stuff and then get them on Canva or Adobe Express or whatever making the podcast artwork. The only stumbling block was when she really actually wanted me to publish it to the world. But, yeah, likewise, her brother wanted to make YouTube videos of himself playing Minecraft or Fortnite or whatever it was at the time. And so I showed him how to edit stuff, and that takes hours.

[00:24:24] – Frankie
Yeah, nice.

[00:24:25] – Steve
That’s why I get paid to do it. So off he went doing that. So you know, if they show an interest in something you do, it’s cool to make the most of that, I think.

[00:24:36] – Frankie
Joanne Grob, she says,

“Solo freelance mama here with an eight-year-old daughter with additional needs. We’re three years into summer holidays now, and I believe I found the routine that works for us. Finally.” That says a lot, doesn’t it? If you’re just at the start of this, three years in, she’s there, so be nice to yourself. “One, we go away for a few nights straight after they break up. We both need the break. This year we’re camping with friends for three nights.”

[00:25:03] – Steve
Oh, nice.

[00:25:04] – Frankie
Joanne continues,

“Two, three days per week of holiday club, which is 9 to 5, so I can get work done. £35 a day, but it’s Forest School, and I’ve coordinated with her friend’s mum, so they’ll be going together which she will love. Three, one day we stay at home or just venture locally.”

Yes, my kind of day.

“Four, one day we’ll do a day out somewhere. Number five, week away for our actual summer holiday in the UK. Number six, new for this year, booking a couple of one or two hour craft clubs, which is time where she’s busy but I’m not working. Otherwise, I don’t get a chance to breathe or meet friends myself.”

Yes, like double clap for that. Like, not just booking childcare to work, but booking time to just not work.

[00:25:51] – Steve
Yes.

[00:25:52] – Frankie
So necessary, obviously, especially if you’re a solo parent.

Joanne continues,

“Seven, I have to work some evenings, too, but that’s inevitable. Also, I’ve booked everything early, so I know it’s done and it saves me panicking at the last minute.”

You got it down, Joanne. This sounds dreamy, honestly.

[00:26:10] – Steve
Rachel Brown says,

“Screens are your friend. In all seriousness, we always have days in school holidays where we submit entirely to the screen gods and just let the kids watch TV and play Switch all day. Even as grownups, we need completely lazy days now and again, and they’ll have a lot of other days of activities. So I feel no guilt about letting them zone out sometimes.”

[00:26:35] – Frankie
Yes, Rachel.

[00:26:37] – Steve
Thank you so much for your comments.

[00:26:39] – Frankie
Yes, brilliant.