[00:00:50] – Frankie
Hello. You’re listening to the Doing It For The Kids podcast, where we swear a bit too much and talk a bit too fast about freelance life with kids in the mix. I’m Frankie and this is Steve.

[00:01:01] – Steve
Hello! Yes. Each episode we take a question from the Doing It For The Kids community. Do our best to answer it, but we start each episode by looking back at the last one. Last time we were talking about-,

[00:01:19] – Frankie
It was Ayo asking us about drumming up work when things were a bit tricky.

[00:01:24] – Steve
But ‘quick’ ways to drum up work — that was key, wasn’t it?

[00:01:27] – Frankie
That’s right. Quick ways to drum up work.

[00:01:29.080] – Steve
Nina got in touch. Nina Lenton, who said,

“I’ve found that writing a list of my last ten clients and thinking about where I found them was useful, then I can see where to focus my marketing efforts once I’ve gone beyond the ‘reaching out to existing or recent clients’.”

[00:01:43] – Frankie
Laura Mingozzi-Marsh says,

“As Steve said, keep reminding them. But my other tip is to add a string to your bow and hit up your existing clients.

I’ve recently learned a lot more about design for accessibility, making sure PDFs can be read correctly by e-readers, ensuring design works for people with different kinds of disabilities etc. And have contacted all my corporate clients about it. They have unanimously shown interest as I’m banging on about it to everyone. I even have a new client who’s specifically employing me just for that skill, something I did not have four months ago! So learn something new and shout about it.”

[00:02:14] – Steve
Brilliant. I love that so much.

[00:02:15] – Frankie
Isn’t it? I know, it’s great.

[00:02:16] – Steve
So brilliantly put because you’ve added to your skillset, but also it’s giving you a reason to reach out to them.

Karina Perdomo says,

“Slow times equal lots more real life networking. I know, I know… but hear me out. My local council organised a few this week, there was a golden opportunity for one-on-ones with decision makers from the big corporations across the borough.”

Ah, yeah, you see? So not just sort of sitting around kicking your heels — get out there. Like it.

[00:02:45] – Frankie
Hannah Strong says,

“PTA raffle prizes.”

[00:02:49] – Steve
What?

[00:02:50] – Frankie
Hannah continues,

“My daughter’s school were looking for local businesses to donate goods or services for their end of year PTA raffle. So I’ve donated my power hour consultancy. Free local exposure for low effort. Happy days.”

[00:03:04] – Steve
That is genius.

And Emily Crosby says on carrying your child for the last time. Oh, yeah, that’s something we were talking about.

Emily says,

“One of my clients was having a conversation with her son about this when he was in his late teens. They agreed that it’s a sad feeling not to know when the last time will be. So she gave him a piggyback home from the restaurant. Now they definitely know the last time she carried him!”

Aw.

As he visits her in hospital for back operations.

I gave my daughter a piggy back this morning! There was a massive puddle…

[00:03:36] – Frankie
Oh, yeah.

[00:03:36] – Steve
Like, huge. There was no way around it, so I had to walk through it. She’s got to be in those shoes all day. So I went, “Come on!” and she held the dog lead while I had her on my back.

[00:03:48] – Frankie
Wow. That’s quite a feat. Well done — dad points. Serious dad points.

[00:07:09] – Frankie
Our question comes from Ange Lyons, who is a graphic designer. Lyons with a Y — lyonscreative.co.uk

Ange asks,

“Hi, Frankie and Steve. Do you think it’s possible to market yourself as a freelancer in 2024 without using social media? Particularly if you hate showing your face? Thanks, Ange.”

[00:07:29] – Steve
Oh, this is a good question.

Yes, is the answer.

[00:07:33.0] – Frankie
Going in strong! Yes.

[00:07:35] – Steve
There we are, thanks for coming…

[00:07:38] – Frankie
I think in a world where we are increasingly having to distinguish between what is real and what isn’t, I think there is definitely a stronger and stronger argument for coming across as a human. And obviously you can do that through literally recording yourself and showing your face and stuff. So I do think there is an argument for that, but I also — as somebody that hates showing my face (and I would like to think I’ve still managed to get my message out there despite it) — I do think there is an argument that you don’t have to do that, but I feel the uniting factor there is being human, whether you show your face or not.

[00:08:17] – Frankie
So, in my case, for example: If I didn’t show my face and was putting out very repetitive sales messages, not really talking about anything else, maybe talking like those sales pages that are all rocket emojis and “are you…” blah, blah, blah. You know, the LinkedIn Bros vibe. If I was doing that and I didn’t show my face, I would lose that humanity, and therefore, I think would not have come across as well. So I think I manage to come across as a human despite not showing my face that much, because I talk about how I feel about things and-,

[00:08:52] – Steve
I see. So it’s possible by adding the human dimension to your text?

[00:08:57] – Frankie
Yes.

[00:09:00] – Steve
I think it’s worth taking a step back from the social media dominance, right? So if you were to try and cut social media out of the equation with a decent website, with decent SEO, you can play a strong hand. Particularly if you’re going after, you know, let’s say… Graphic design in your geographical area. You start with that kind of target. So you’d be going for a local business edge with your SEO, with your Google My Business. You’d be getting reviews and things like that.

So there’s a copywriter in the Being Freelance community called Graham Piper. His company’s called Drop Cap Copy. He’s really dominant in his local area — you know, like, “copywriting in Devon”. I don’t really ever see Graham on Instagram or even LinkedIn really. He’s on there, but he’s not talking to the camera. You don’t often see his face (though it’s a beautiful face, in case Graham hears this). But he’s doing the thing where his website speaks for him, where his SEO speaks for him, and then he gets to know local businesses, local agencies, and, you know, has a more traditional way of actually getting out there and meeting people and getting word of mouth on a local level.

[00:10:05] – Steve
But his website is brilliant and working for him. Yeah, I don’t think we should ever underestimate the power of that. But when they land on your website, I still think it’s worth having your face on it so that people trust you and they see that you’re a real person?

[00:10:20] – Frankie
I’m with you on that, definitely. On a website, you need to come across as a real person, for sure.

[00:10:26] – Steve
Following on from your web presence is the use of email and email marketing. That doesn’t necessarily mean showing up with your face, but, you know… creating blog content, written useful blog content, content marketing, marketing on your website, reusing that and building up a list so that you ‘own it’, in quotation marks. All of that is a really strong technique to go down. It doesn’t need to have your face, as you say, though.

You know, when you talk about still sounding human in your writing and things like that, it’s still a chance for you to do that. But it doesn’t mean that you have to be showing up online with your face on social media. People constantly tell you to try and get people off of social media onto your own email list and things, right?

[00:11:11] – Frankie
I mean, the email specialists among us will be shouting at their audio players. But yeah, email is super powerful. There’s no algorithm to fight. It’s a direct link to people that are interested in the thing that you offer. And yes, you can definitely come across as human in an email in such a more intimate way? A bit like podcasting, actually. It’s a much more direct, one-to-one chat in a way that a lot of social media is very ‘broadcast’. Particularly LinkedIn and Instagram actually. All of them. All of them. It’s like, “Oh, here’s my take on stuff. Here’s my thing. You should buy it. We want to get as many likes as possible, I don’t really care who you are” kind of vibe. Whereas something like podcasting and email marketing is like… you are talking one-on-one to somebody else. Yeah, there’s real value from a marketing perspective and building that kind of correspondence with somebody and yeah — in either of those formats, you don’t need your face on it at all.

[00:12:06] – Steve
So you’re saying that actually doing a podcast…

[00:12:09] – Frankie
Oh, doing a podcast is brilliant way to build relationships!

[00:12:12] – Steve
But it’s not your face.

[00:12:13] – Frankie
No, it’s not. It really isn’t.

[00:12:15] – Steve
Yeah, it’s not social media and it’s not face. So it does qualify for Ange’s question.

[00:12:20] – Frankie
Although a lot of people would say podcasting is now video and the two are intertwined and you can’t one without the other.

[00:12:23] – Steve
Yeah, but-,

[00:12:25] – Frankie
I would argue it’s not!

[00:12:26] – Steve
You know, the video aspect of podcasting is useful for promoting it on social media. That’s undeniable.

[00:12:34] – Frankie
Yeah. This doesn’t go out on YouTube, does it?

[00:12:36] – Steve
We don’t put it on YouTube.

[00:12:37] – Frankie
It’d be a mess!! We edit it so much, it would just be a big visual mush.

And sure — it might feel a bit counterintuitive if you’re a designer to launch a podcast. Maybe it doesn’t feel like those two things align? But I would argue there are so many things you could talk about that your clients are interested in without showing the visual work. Although that stuff’s good.

Yes, if we’re talking about a visual creative freelancer, like a designer or an illustrator… If you don’t want to be showing your face, the best thing you can be doing is showing your workings; showing your process. Doing all that ‘behind the scenes’ stuff — and that could just be your hands, or a voiceover describing what you’re doing, what projects you’re working on for your clients, what your challenges are, blah, blah, blah, blah. None of that involves your face. You can still make it visually interesting. Lots of people do that very successfully.

[00:13:35] – Steve
You can really lean-,

Oh, I feel like a twat saying “lean into”, it feels like such a-,

[00:13:42] – Frankie
Embrace?

[00:13:43] – Steve
Have a cuddle with?

[00:13:44] – Frankie
Sure.

[00:13:47] – Steve
I do think if you’re talking about building it off of social media as well, really emphasising and embracing the local business element can be brilliant.

[00:13:57] – Frankie
Which we actually talked about a lot in the last episode. 109. Go back!

[00:14:00] – Steve
We’ve said about your SEO, Google My Business, but also getting out there to local business events, cold interactions becoming warmer interactions with all the local businesses that are around you. None of that needs you on social media showing your face. I think it’s a really strong way to build a business.

I mean, imagine if you spent all the time you spend on social media on building your business in a different way? In creating a blog post that really lasted for years and years and years, bringing you great SEO, showing you’re an expert… Oh my God, why aren’t we doing this??

[00:14:37] – Frankie
Yeah, right.

[00:14:37] – Steve
What are we doing.

[00:14:41] – Frankie
No, genuinely, that’s a really good point. Like, that is a question I should be asking myself: What could I achieve if I stopped using social media? What other marketing could I achieve?

[00:14:53] – Steve
I still feel, though — if you were only going to do one piece of social media, to make that one thing LinkedIn. And you don’t need to be showing your face.

[00:15:01] – Frankie
Lots of people do. That seems to be the way to game the algorithm, doesn’t it?

[00:15:04] – Steve
But you don’t need to, particularly because a lot of the strength is commenting on other people’s stuff.

[00:15:10] – Frankie
Yes, that’s true.

[00:15:10] – Steve
Seeking out people that you want to work with, following their things, interacting with their stuff. You don’t have to play the game of taking a selfie, making a video, creating content and all of that. Yes, that’s one way of doing it. But you could simply play it as a way of finding businesses to work with. Commenting on people you already know — being seen by their greater networks.
I mean, even without any of that — it’s such a powerful CV. You know, when people click on your profile, it shows all of your experience. It shows if you’ve done it right, like referrals, testimony at the bottom and things like that. It’s brilliant. So I wouldn’t ditch LinkedIn. I just wouldn’t necessarily play the game of shoving my face on it if I really didn’t want to.

[00:15:53] – Frankie
At the risk of repeating myself, in the last episode, I talked about how connections are the key to being a successful freelancer, and I think that’s very relevant here in that you cannot argue with the fact that social media is literally about connections. While there are ways of doing that in the real world — building connections with other people (whether they’re going to buy from you or not, they might know other people, etc, etc) — you cannot argue with the power of social media in that context. So is it possible to market yourself as a freelancer in 2024 without using it? Yes. But if the bottom line is building connections, you have the entire Internet at your fingertips in a way that you do not doing it other ways.

[00:16:37] – Steve
It’s interesting as well that social media can become almost ‘back up’ proof that you exist, particularly in a world, as you said, that has so much AI and robots and fakeness in it. To be able to go to your website and see that this person has this history online, has these relationships. That doesn’t need to be, you know, your face plastered everywhere, but it just goes to show that you’re active and you’re around. That’s pretty cool.

[00:17:10] – Frankie
I also think if you are in any way running a niche business or you have a niche target audience, again — you cannot argue with social media. Say you go to a networking event local to you, the likelihood that one of those people is going to fit your specific criteria is quite small. But if you’re putting out your niche to the entire Internet, you’re going to be able to find the ‘right’, in inverted commas, people who might be interested in what it is that you sell in a way that is much harder to do. But I would also argue you can do that through SEO. Those two things are intertwined, aren’t they? If there’s like a really specific thing that people are putting into Google, you want to be coming up in response to that search.

[00:17:52] – Steve
And social media is a great reinforcer of the local connections that you might make. It can really speed up a getting to know you kind of process.

[00:18:01] – Frankie
Yeah, that’s a good point. I do that! I’ll meet them in real life and then we’ll follow each other on the Internet. And then it just builds from there and you get a real sense of what each other are talking about and doing. And then when you maybe see each other again, it’s like you’ve jumped so much further in your relationship.

[00:18:21] – Steve
Well, there we go. I think that was good.

Is it possible to do it without social media? Yes. Are you missing a trick? Yes. Will you also save lots of time that you could put into different marketing channels? Absolutely.

[00:18:34] – Frankie
Like a bit of nuance.

[00:18:36] – Steve
There’s part of me that sometimes says, you know, for people who don’t want to show up online — the more you do it, the more you get over it, the more comfortable it becomes. I’ve even seen it with people who we both probably know who didn’t want to be on there, who are now showing their face on Instagram, for example. And now you see them all the time and they’re totally over it. But I also think that if the thought of doing that… Like, if you’ve tried it and it didn’t work out, if that just makes you anxious, if it’s not doing good things for you. Then you don’t have to do it. You absolutely don’t. You can run your business in a way that works for you.